Elijah Mohammad
Registered on
Oct-14-2005
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Message #114526 posted by Elijah Mohammad (Info) May 12, 2008 15:58:09 ET
In Reply to: Re: Soldiers Back From Iraq Testify About War Crim posted by Torog (Info) May 12, 2008 06:14:26 ET
"Howdy Elijah,
You claim:
"By "not a big deal," it means, it didn't seem out of the ordinary....if you see people killed all the time, then seeing more people killed doesn't seem as much out of the ordinary to you......what did seem out of the ordinary, and a big deal, was being ordered by people he respected to murder hundreds to thousands of innocent civilians. "
So why haven't we seen any reports of these mass killings of innocent civilians being slaughtered by the thousands,everytime a firefight erupts ?"
Because thousands aren't slaughtered "everytime a firefight erupts." if 110 innocent people were killed by US troops every day in the whole of Iraq, that would meet the quota of 200,000 killed by now, 5 years later. How many firefights would you say erupt every day in Iraq over the whole country on average? I'd say 20 at the very least....if 5 or 6 innocent civillians are killed in each one, then that's 200,000 in 5 years.....often, more than 5 or 6 are killed at a time though when bombs and artillery are used.....also, there are the dirty bombs we use which have polluted their country with radiation since Gulf War I, which, in combination with economic sanctions where we denied food to their children, have killed millions by now.
"You state:
"Any soldier who refuses to fight in a war where he is routinely expected to terrify the populace of a foreign country, and kill innocent civilians is a good soldier in my book....the ones who continue in these wicked things show you that they weren't good soldiers to begin with."
I agree with ya..now please provide a copy of those orders."
Certainly....as soon as you provide a copy of the orders given by Iran to bring weapons to Iraq....or how about the orders given in Vietnam....but then, you probably can't can you? Why is that? Hmmmm, oh yeah! Maybe it's because orders like that aren't usually given in writing......as far as I know, according to the Bible, the testimony of two or three witnesses is enough, or did you forget that part? I have given you the testimony of about 10 different witnesses. I'm sure I can find more if you want, though you haven't even had time yet to examine the testimony of the witnesses I have given thus far.
"You ask: "So what is your real goal in Iraq, Torog?"
To establish a democracy that will counter islamist tryanny and leave in place,a country that will not attack our allies or blackmail the world over it's oil."
So basically you want to bring your political/religious system over there, and force their people by continual slaying and raping and oppression to install a regime that will bow to all demands of the United States and Israel. OK, got it....I thought that was basically what I said before?
"You state:
"Obviously you haven't watched the other videos either, in which soldiers speak of mass rape, kidnapping, and torture which they were ordered to partake in, and took relish in in many cases."
Again,show me a copy of the orders."
Again, Certainly....as soon as you provide a copy of the orders given by Iran to bring weapons to Iraq....or how about the orders given in Vietnam....but then, you probably can't can you? Why is that? Hmmmm, oh yeah! Maybe it's because orders like that aren't usually given in writing......as far as I know, according to the Bible, the testimony of two or three witnesses is enough, or did you forget that part? I have given you the testimony of about 10 different witnesses. I'm sure I can find more if you want, though you haven't even had time yet to examine the testimony of the witnesses I have given thus far.
"You state:
"You think it is an evil religion and has an evil political system, and you think that your religion and political system are better."
Yup..not only do I think such,but I know such,because I lived under such."
REALLY!?!? I didn't know that, Torog....I thought you only lived in Saudi Arabia.....So, the time you spent in Iraq, Iran, Syria, Lebanon, and Afghanistan was pretty similar to Saudi Arabia then? That's really funny, Torog, because I was sure that I'd never seen you write about being in any of those other places....could you tell me about your time there, in Iraq, Iran, Syria, Lebanon, and Afghanistan?
"I don't want to kill every adult muslim,nor do I want them to change their religion,unless they choose to do such,Christianity is purely voluntary at this time-whereas Islam demands that non-muslims must submit to Islam and pay the jizrya tax and submit to muslim authority..or be slaughtered"
That's really funny, because I thought that there were many Christians in the countries you attacked, and want to attack. In fact, one of Saddam's top guys was a Christian. Aren't you guys demanding that non-Christian non-Westerners submit to the Holy Roman Empire/Israel, and pay the tax for your wars and occupation against them and submit to their authority or else be slaughtered? If not, then why do you guys continually subvert their democratic processes, and install leaders that will do such, and occupy their countries until they obey you and pay your fees and submit to your governing authority?
"You ask:
"Tell me, Torog, how many Muslims have attacked America to try to change the internal workings of its political system and religions?"
Well..there's 2 WTC attacks on our soil,for starters and numerous other plots that have been foiled,as for the number of muslims involved,that's larger than the actual perpetrators involved,as they had extensive backing from over-seas muslims."
Really.....I haven't seen any proof that Muslims attacked the World Trade center....where is such proof available?
"I went to wikipedia and looked up 'infidel':
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Infidel
Looks like you were right about the term,but I'm right about the modern application of 'infidel' by extremist muslims. Atheists like LT,would be called 'kafir' and folks like me,are 'People of the Book'.
I'll try and watch a couple of more videos,I wasn't able to watch more than one,yesterday,because I had company staying here overnight.
Have a good one ..."
You're right about the modern application of the word infidel? How so? Muslims use the word "Kafir" and "Kafiroon," and Westerners may have translated that as "infidel" before....but it more correctly translates as "disbeliever," or "unbeliever." You guys are the ones pressing on with your "Holy" War against the "infidels" in foreign lands.....and for what? Oil and Israel....pretty much just like always....before, in the Crusades of centuries ago, it was Gold and Israel....but now, Oil is the Black Gold.
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